tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post1345530240840754019..comments2024-01-02T02:18:30.960-08:00Comments on Israel Thrives: Is Barack Obama a Fool or a Liar?Mike L.http://www.blogger.com/profile/06450806807610560873noreply@blogger.comBlogger61125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-47047737537280031642012-08-22T23:10:38.530-07:002012-08-22T23:10:38.530-07:00Too bad Billy never got to try a Petrus Aged Pale,...Too bad Billy never got to try a Petrus Aged Pale, as I did at Kraftwork down in Fishtown earlier this week. He would have forgotten Billy Beer in a heart beat! ;)<br /><br />Now on to find that Monk's Cafe Flemish Sour this weekend sometime...JayinPhiladelphiahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14556212008313470286noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-36505473920092078232012-08-22T22:47:04.758-07:002012-08-22T22:47:04.758-07:00"Do you mean the guy who actually got the Cam..."Do you mean the guy who actually got the Camp David treaty signed and made it AGAINST U.S. LAW to follow the Arab boycott? That President Carter? "<br /><br />Yeah, that would be the fella. It's a travesty of the truth to credit him with any of the guts of Sadat and Begin. Sure he got his mug upfront and centre. You can praise him for that if you are an American Democrat but I demur for sure.<br /><br />This is the President who was in situ when the Islamic Revolution swept Iran. To me he is just another strange American man who can't see what is going on in front of his nose.<br /><br />You can't blame Chamberlain for the Nazis. He wasn't Prime Minister when they took Germany. He just appeased them. However Carter was President when they took Iran. <br /><br />Carter's brother would have made a better president. He couldn't have done any more harm and at least it would have been more entertaining.geoffffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10056725010151459750noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-8269866888250114042012-08-22T21:19:19.747-07:002012-08-22T21:19:19.747-07:00This is some simplistic armchair analysis you have...This is some simplistic armchair analysis you have provided.<br /><br />Personally, I would have picked Mubarak in similar circumstances. This illustrated to the world that these MB guys are legitimate in American eyes. It benefited the MB without a doubt, when their beliefs are what should have been publicized instead.<br /><br />The NAM is far from "stupid" and has much more influence than you give credit. It often tips the balance at the UN and elsewhere when decisions are made by states. It is the international legal arena where the antipathy against the West effectively practiced. When the NAM partners with the OIC to abuse the mechanisms, it has profound effect.<br /><br />This speculation about Egypt's intent to attend is absent any foundation. To "make their play?" Have you any information to support that notion?<br /><br />The fact that people worry about a swing by Egypt to China contradicts the claim that our $2 billion gives us so much influence. Perhaps the aid is better seen as buying a situation off so it will not become even worse.<br /><br />Finally, the "make-up" of Egypt politically is why it was a bad decision to treat the MB and now the state as if they want "friendly relations and co-operation" when they are unhesitant to practice hate and incitement that actually violates the Genocide Convention of 1948.oldschooltwentysixhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15672887176887940797noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-19000708834041022682012-08-22T21:07:01.535-07:002012-08-22T21:07:01.535-07:00Morsi is an Islamist in a suit and tie who will so...Morsi is an Islamist in a suit and tie who will soon be having tea at the White House.Mike L.https://www.blogger.com/profile/06450806807610560873noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-47825887310103749512012-08-22T21:04:16.960-07:002012-08-22T21:04:16.960-07:00Exactly. And crowds would still publicly chant me...Exactly. And crowds would still publicly chant medieval, genocidal racist shit like "Khaybar Khaybar ya Yahud!" If I were to post a series of diaries at progressive-left blog Daily Kos, asking the wonderful, self-proclaimed 'anti-racists' there when this would stop, how long do you suppose it would be until I was banned?<br /><br />36 hours? 48?<br /><br />Whenever Meteor "the Nazis were a blip" Blades next checked his email?JayinPhiladelphiahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14556212008313470286noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-15024287009995400852012-08-22T20:23:56.284-07:002012-08-22T20:23:56.284-07:00And you know what the worst of it is Jay? Even if ...And you know what the worst of it is Jay? Even if it hadn't turned out like it did and the MB had been defeated by all those fresh faced secular Facebook democracy seeking types, they'd STILL hate Jews and Israel. Sucks to be Egypt, man.Doodadhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03349941094682080146noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-73755399970517691782012-08-22T19:43:34.740-07:002012-08-22T19:43:34.740-07:00I can certainly agree with that, Doodad.I can certainly agree with that, Doodad.JayinPhiladelphiahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14556212008313470286noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-51274207957883971882012-08-22T19:29:20.707-07:002012-08-22T19:29:20.707-07:00The overall thing we must not forget is that Egypt...The overall thing we must not forget is that Egypt is now an Islamist country. That really says it all. No good will come of this.Doodadhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03349941094682080146noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-89715371951878053632012-08-22T18:17:05.029-07:002012-08-22T18:17:05.029-07:00Just a quick note.
volleyboy claims -
"Nope...Just a quick note.<br /><br />volleyboy claims -<br /><br />"Nope... I don't criticize you anyone who criticizes the MB and points out the rabid nature of their politics. I criticize those who wrongfully criticize the administration and distort its policies and record."<br /><br />oldschool says -<br /><br />"no matter the policy, you criticize anyone that criticizes Obama, in pejorative terms no less."<br /><br />volleyboy, in reference to me, with zero explanation or references to alleged "derangement," a few days ago said -<br /><br />"I <a href="http://www.progressivezionist.com/2012/08/these-are-your-people-yes-we-are-all.html?showComment=1345178059908#c6668829235463117991" rel="nofollow">tried to reach out</a> to the ODS crowd but there is just too much nuttiness there. I mean you can't talk rationally with these people. It's everything taken to the way too furthest degree. <strong>You should see the hatred and drivel now especially with their newest convert.</strong>"<br /><br />Now, I'm only undergoing one 'conversion process' these days, and it has nothing whatsoever to do with the president. :)<br /><br />But anyway...<br /><br />Oldschool is demonstrably correct in this instance. In fact, one need not even criticize the president to qualify for this treatment from our guest. Not that I care in the least what volleyboy1 thinks about me, but just for the purposes of establishing who has integrity here, I do believe this is relevant.JayinPhiladelphiahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14556212008313470286noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-10812011290459226662012-08-22T17:31:54.081-07:002012-08-22T17:31:54.081-07:00Heaven? Well, better than of late for sure. And th...Heaven? Well, better than of late for sure. And that's a good thing, V. Enjoy your workout.Doodadhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03349941094682080146noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-65378216675882399472012-08-22T17:02:55.311-07:002012-08-22T17:02:55.311-07:00You mean Hamas mode.... That is more the MB model....You mean Hamas mode.... That is more the MB model. <br /><br />Anyway, they will stay in control as long as they balance the Military and civilian demands. That is a tough act to follow until they can get control of the S.C.A.F. <br /><br />Doodad, that is NOT looking through "Rose colored glasses"... that is looking at what is reality. <br /><br />So listen, now I have to go, and do some Israeli fighting.. heh. So if I don't get back to you for a few hours that's why. <br /><br />Been a slice of heaven. volleyboy1https://www.blogger.com/profile/02899507817699308811noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-32685370857928003802012-08-22T16:59:13.496-07:002012-08-22T16:59:13.496-07:00Now wait a minute:
When it comes to facing up to ...Now wait a minute:<br /><br /><em>When it comes to facing up to Jihadism for what it is your President is the weakest and most dangerous since Jimmy Carter.</em><br /><br />Do you mean the guy who actually got the Camp David treaty signed and made it AGAINST U.S. LAW to follow the Arab boycott? That President Carter? <br /><br />Jimmy Carter was a bad President and I didn't vote for him (I voted for third party John Anderson that year). But for Israel he was far better as a President than either his predecessor (Gerald Ford) or his successor (Ronald Reagan). As an ex-President he is awful. <br /><br />As for this:<br /><br /><em>He may well be the weakest and most dangerous Western leader in facing up to Jihadism since Neville Chamberlain.</em> <br /><br />Wow, so the President that found and killed Osama Bin-Laden and more of the Al-Qaeda and Taliban leadership in four years than Bush did in eight is the "most dangerous Western Leader in facing up to Jihadism since Neville Chamberlin". Who knew? I mean I thought killing Jihadi's was actually standing against them. I stand corrected (/snark). <br /><br />But for argument's sake let's say you're right. What would Romney do differently? So far, he hasn't said anything different, AND his advisers are all part of Team Bush that did pretty much EVERYTHING wrong in the "War on Terror". But hey, tell me why they are better than the current administration. <br /><br />Anyway, who in the world is talking about "appeasing" Jihadi's. No one. Not me and if you think I am, re-read my comments. I don't want them appeased, I want them wiped out, and there is nothing in Mitt Romney or the Republican playbook that I can see that would accomplish this. <br /><br />volleyboy1https://www.blogger.com/profile/02899507817699308811noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-33329359803400058652012-08-22T16:56:36.402-07:002012-08-22T16:56:36.402-07:00Well, keep looking through those rose colored glas...Well, keep looking through those rose colored glasses. The MB is in control and IMHO they will stay in control. My crystal ball says Egypt has seen its last election in quite some time. They are in Abbas mode now.Doodadhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03349941094682080146noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-44268035067321617332012-08-22T16:47:45.381-07:002012-08-22T16:47:45.381-07:00Well let's see... if they turn to the Israelis...Well let's see... if they turn to the Israelis their base will chuck them. If they break the economy ALL of the Egyptians will do it. They did it with Mubarak - what makes you think they can't do it again. <br /><br />Even Nasser faced open hostility in the streets. But I bet the Mubarak regime said the same thing about the "Facebook Kids". But you forget the SCAF (the military) has heavy economic interests that they will simply not allow to be threatened. Do you really think, if those interests are threatened, they will allow that to stand. They are the military not just some "facebook kids". volleyboy1https://www.blogger.com/profile/02899507817699308811noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-48788539501467432852012-08-22T16:30:01.699-07:002012-08-22T16:30:01.699-07:00Who is the "other guy"? Mitt Romney.... ...Who is the "other guy"? Mitt Romney.... <br /><br />Well Geoff, you do know what his party (the Republicans) stands for in relation to the Saudis, right? I mean I can only assume that since you seem to understand that that you know that the Bush Family and G.W. (the last Bush President) called the Saudi King a "member of his family". You do know that the Reagan and Bush I administrations were huge on funding the Saudi military and were great friends with them? Right???? <br /><br />I mean, if anyone, the Republicans, and particularly Reagan and both Bush's are responsible for our tight relationship with the K.S.A. Given that Mitt Romney wants to bring the Bush team BACK into the White House, why would you suggest voting for them? volleyboy1https://www.blogger.com/profile/02899507817699308811noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-86794178219521999952012-08-22T16:25:31.433-07:002012-08-22T16:25:31.433-07:00Who is going to "toss them out of office?&quo...Who is going to "toss them out of office?" The Facebook kids? Get real.Doodadhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03349941094682080146noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-49060232315581519332012-08-22T16:22:20.583-07:002012-08-22T16:22:20.583-07:00Hmmm, Obama went to Cairo and insisted the Opposit...Hmmm, Obama went to Cairo and insisted the Opposition attend his speech. I would have done the same, but, I can see your objections on that and those too make sense. <br /><br />As for Morsi going to Iran... He is... and he is going to visit the U.S. and China as well. <br /><br />NOW, the China visit is what worries me more than the Iranian visit. The Iranian visit is just part of that stupid conference of "non-aligned nations" a tired old piece of "we hate the West" propaganda generation and designed to give Iran a role as the leader against the U.S. - but Egypt wants to return to regional prominence so it is not surprising they would attend and make their play. <br /><br />The visit to China is much rougher stuff. That could be a signal (and I say <em><strong>could be</strong></em>) that Egypt will be trying to look other places than the U.S. (due to restrictions on U.S. aid) to make up for a break in the alliance. On the other hand it could just be a visit from a Head of State to an important nation. I think it is too early to be definitive on what it means. <br /><br />I seriously don't think Obama's invitation to the Brotherhood "opened a door" to their coming to power of anything else. Look at the make-up of the Egyptian parliament. It is heavily MB and Salafist. That is where the Egyptians were politically. I don't think the President had anything to do with the elections to begin with or the rise of the Brotherhood. They were already there. volleyboy1https://www.blogger.com/profile/02899507817699308811noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-33753333447521954842012-08-22T16:10:02.238-07:002012-08-22T16:10:02.238-07:00But wait Doodad, the SAMS (anti-aircraft weaponry)...But wait Doodad, the SAMS (anti-aircraft weaponry) thing is important. You have been asserting this for a couple of days, and by implication as we see in this thread that it is the fault of the Obama administration that there are SAM's in the Sinai in violation of the treaty. That is a very, very serious breach of the treaty and one that would (in my mind) be an act of war. <br /><br />But that's not what happened. <br /><br />Now you are correct (as I have said before) that the Egyptians by moving armor and helicopters in ARE in violation of the treaty. However, I believe the Israelis (and Americans) are smart enough to realize that the treaty in this case does have to be amended to allow for the Egyptians to maintain control over the Sinai. <br /><br />Al-Qaeda has heavy weapons, and the training (as we saw in the deaths of the 16 Egyptian soldiers in a terrorist attack) to wreck heavy damage. They weren't around when the treaty was signed. The Israelis recognize this. So allowing a few tanks and Helicopters into the Sinai does nothing to abrogate the spirit of the treaty. If you were Israeli you would probably let this happen. This minor force does nothing to threaten the IDF, and yet allows Morsi to toss "red meat" to the masses (who are pissed off that Egypt CUT-OFF Gaza by closing the Rafah crossing as punishment for the terror strikes (that Hamas knew about). <br /><br />However, what's your alternative to what the Obama administration is doing here or what the Netanyahu administration is doing there. How far do you think they should take this issue?volleyboy1https://www.blogger.com/profile/02899507817699308811noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-79106424556673190152012-08-22T16:09:50.335-07:002012-08-22T16:09:50.335-07:00I think it is a bad move to invite him. He is a di...I think it is a bad move to invite him. He is a dictator, as these past weeks have made clear.<br /><br />That is right, no matter the policy, you criticize anyone that criticizes Obama, in pejorative terms no less.<br /><br />I said democracy is not a PROPER noun or adjective, which means it is not capitalized unless starting a sentence. You have referred to Egyptian Democracy several times.<br /><br />You did not assert anything about the missiles, yet in essence you did assert that Israel would be doing something covert if they were deployed.<br /><br />I made no assertion whatsoever on the matter, but stated it was an open question. I have no obligation to provide a source, or to challenge others, despite what you believe. Nor is my opinion on the matter relevant, except to argue about the unknown. I have better things to do.oldschooltwentysixhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15672887176887940797noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-14832409541853999362012-08-22T15:59:15.222-07:002012-08-22T15:59:15.222-07:00Oh and to finish the thought on how the Egyptian G...Oh and to finish the thought on how the Egyptian Government is damned either way... <br /><br />IF they chose to abrogate the treaty, they would immediately lose $ 2 billion in U.S. aid and would forced into a situation where their ailing economy would be forced to nearly shut down. How long do you think they stay in power when their economy fails? volleyboy1https://www.blogger.com/profile/02899507817699308811noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-50671783464368147922012-08-22T15:56:38.639-07:002012-08-22T15:56:38.639-07:00Reality is what one makes it. Actually the MB is d...<em>Reality is what one makes it. Actually the MB is damned neither way...it's all good for them. </em><br /><br />Wait... now we are discussing the nature of "reality"??? And no the MB is "damned" either way. <br /><br />Let's look at that shall we?<br /><br />IF the Egyptian Government goes to the Israelis and publicly says "Look we need your help fighting terror in the Sinai, let's do joint patrols and you give us permission to use armor and helicopters as a special amendment to the Treaty AND we in return give you permission to actually have Israeli advisers and troops over Egyptian territory then we are good to go - right?"<br /><br />That government would last all of about 5 minutes after news like that broke. Regardless of what one thinks, who in their right mind thinks ANYONE in the world would do that? I mean do you really think the Egyptians would? <br /><br />Personally I would love it if they did that but there is more chance of a Batman riding in on the outside of a flying saucer piloted by Bugs Bunny and the Smurfs than anything like that happening. <br /><br /><em>BTW I find it very odd there is SO little press about this coming out of Israel. Lips are pretty tight. </em><br /><br />HUH??? There are stories up on Ynet and Haaretz right now on this and there have been for days. Everyone is talking about the Egyptians in the Sinai. Including this Headline: <br /><br /><em><strong>Report: Israel, Egypt reach understanding over military deployment in Sinai</strong></em>:<br /><br /><em>An Egyptian military official says an understanding has been achieved between Israel and Egypt concerning deployment of troops in the Sinai Peninsula.</em><br /><br />As for this:<br /><br /><em>And of course politicians go against their base all the time. All the freaking time once elected. It's almost a requirement.</em><br /><br />Not to the point that it would get them tossed out of office - immediately by their base. If Morsi went against his base to the degree that you ask, he would be facing millions in the street and his longevity could be measured in days if not minutes. <br />volleyboy1https://www.blogger.com/profile/02899507817699308811noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-56251094592435451602012-08-22T15:55:32.068-07:002012-08-22T15:55:32.068-07:00SAMS or not, the Egyptians HAVE violated the peace...SAMS or not, the Egyptians HAVE violated the peace treaty by moving stuff there unilaterally. I believe I read they had permission to move some extra troops but not anything else. So, the treaty has been violated and everyone is just pussyfooting around about it as far as I can see. The MB has everyone by the bag and I bet they are laughing their heads off about it.Doodadhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03349941094682080146noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-82639929917855766942012-08-22T15:48:28.761-07:002012-08-22T15:48:28.761-07:00I don't think I used the term "liberal&qu...I don't think I used the term "liberal".<br /><br />And "secular" in that part of the world is relative. <br /><br />The failure of the US and the West to stem the poison that flows from Saudi Arabia and other Arab "allies" in to even our countries let alone the Middle East is a scandalous failure of foreign policy. <br /><br />Thank you for reminding me of a third reason to vote for the other guy. geoffffhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10056725010151459750noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-57493533504039862692012-08-22T15:41:44.917-07:002012-08-22T15:41:44.917-07:00So inviting the Egyptian head of State (a country ...So inviting the Egyptian head of State (a country you give $ 2 billion in aid to every year on the condition they hold to the Peace treaty with Israel) is now all of a sudden capitulation? Don't you think the head of the country who gets that much U.S. $$$ should be invited to the White House as befits the leader of a major country in the area? <br /><br /><em>You are not afraid to confront the MB, yet criticize those who do and rationalize why they should not.</em><br /><br />Nope... I don't criticize you anyone who criticizes the MB and points out the rabid nature of their politics. I criticize those who wrongfully criticize the administration and distort its policies and record. <br /><br />Criticize the MB all you like (not that you need my permission). I won't say "BOO". They are awful. But let's keep the discussion in the world of reality. <br /><br />And not to be petty but:<br /><br /><em>de·moc·ra·cy <strong>noun</strong> \di-ˈmä-krə-sē\<br />plural de·moc·ra·cies</em><br /><br />http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/democracy<br /><br /><em>The anti-aircraft missile debate shows that you have no more idea than anyone, despite your speculation about the matter and useless question about what I believe, which matters not one iota in the scheme of things.</em><br /><br />Nope. I am not the one that asserted that the Egyptians put SAM Batteries (or other anti-Aircraft) systems into the Sinai that violated the treaty. Doodad did, and he did it without verifying it. You seem to be loathe to address that point. <br /><br />Now I didn't assert anything on this for you. You seem to be making that up as well. But I will ask you again in a very straight forward manner:<br /><br /><em>Also, do you believe that the Egyptians have moved SAM batteries or other anti-aircraft batteries into the Sinai in violation of the Peace Treaty?</em><br /><br />and let me add... If so, then what is your source and reasoning. If not what is your reasoning and why are you not challenging Doodad's assertion. Pretty straight forward here - I am not sure just why you won't state your opinion. <br /><br /><br />volleyboy1https://www.blogger.com/profile/02899507817699308811noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-21198620044092544342012-08-22T15:35:22.072-07:002012-08-22T15:35:22.072-07:00Reality is what one makes it. Actually the MB is d...Reality is what one makes it. Actually the MB is damned neither way...it's all good for them. <br /><br />BTW I find it very odd there is SO little press about this coming out of Israel. Lips are pretty tight. <br /><br />And of course politicians go against their base all the time. All the freaking time once elected. It's almost a requirement.Doodadhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03349941094682080146noreply@blogger.com