tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post4055103298547282873..comments2024-01-02T02:18:30.960-08:00Comments on Israel Thrives: Mike L.http://www.blogger.com/profile/06450806807610560873noreply@blogger.comBlogger51125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-59344429941588305262015-06-10T21:46:15.495-07:002015-06-10T21:46:15.495-07:00I think the US can pressure them in several ways b...I think the US can pressure them in several ways both directly AND indirectly by pressuring those who support them with both monetary and political largesse, were the US willing to do so. Obama apparently isn't willing, the Congress is at least somewhat willing.<br />Obama's policies have been bad for Israel, diplomatically, and strategically. There's no getting around that. <br />If the western nations think that a two state solution with two states living side by side in peace is an ideal outcome, it's one they certainly don't really want. Proof? Just look at their behavior, i.e., it is imperialistic, chauvinistic, racist, anti-Semitic, and altogether counterproductive to its core.JeffwithaJhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07073609950380822171noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-29861143318481523972015-06-10T09:02:49.316-07:002015-06-10T09:02:49.316-07:00Mike, I don't think you are reading what I am ...Mike, I don't think you are reading what I am writing. You said:<br /><br /><em>So, you agree that the PA or Hamas or, just, the Palestinian-Arab polity, can be pressured in theory, but not in actuality?</em><br /><br /> No, Mike that is not at all what I said. <br /><br /><em>It's not a matter of what they are "above" or "beyond", I mean anyone CAN be pressured in theory - it is specific to what can the U.S. do to pressure them.</em><br /><br />That is a very different thing than saying that they are "impervious" to political pressure. <br /><br />So I ask you again? What specifically can the U.S. do to pressure the Palestinians and more to the point not only what can we do, but HOW should we pressure them. <br /><br />How is this an "unusual" point of view?volleyboy1https://www.blogger.com/profile/02899507817699308811noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-88940687401887675322015-06-10T08:40:33.291-07:002015-06-10T08:40:33.291-07:00So, you agree that the PA or Hamas or, just, the P...So, you agree that the PA or Hamas or, just, the Palestinian-Arab polity, can be pressured in theory, but not in actuality?<br /><br />VB, you must understand that this is a highly unusual point of view.<br /><br />I have never heard of any political entity, or of any people, who are almost entirely impervious to political pressures.<br /><br />Are there others that are likewise impervious?<br /><br />One thing is certain, Israel is not.Mike L.https://www.blogger.com/profile/06450806807610560873noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-68522941869203812012015-06-10T07:45:56.289-07:002015-06-10T07:45:56.289-07:00Interesting projection here Trudy. Interesting projection here Trudy. volleyboy1https://www.blogger.com/profile/02899507817699308811noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-970941194072328002015-06-10T07:45:11.162-07:002015-06-10T07:45:11.162-07:00Well Ok Mike.. What can the U.S. pressure the P.A....Well Ok Mike.. What can the U.S. pressure the P.A. or Hamas with? Better question.. HOW should they pressure them?<br /><br />It's not a matter of what they are "above" or "beyond", I mean anyone CAN be pressured in theory - it is specific to what can the U.S. do to pressure them. <br /><br />What do you think would be effective? volleyboy1https://www.blogger.com/profile/02899507817699308811noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-27979403669016922232015-06-10T07:01:03.441-07:002015-06-10T07:01:03.441-07:00VB, suffice it to say that I find it rather unusua...VB, suffice it to say that I find it rather unusual that you think that the US and the EU have nothing to pressure the Palestinian-Arabs with.<br /><br />So, you're saying that the reason Obama pressures Israel, but does not pressure the PA or Hamas is because he has no such ability?<br /><br />The Palestinian-Arabs are beyond, or above, pressure?<br /><br />What an unusual thing to say.Mike L.https://www.blogger.com/profile/06450806807610560873noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-69907504726074053322015-06-10T06:36:29.777-07:002015-06-10T06:36:29.777-07:00You seem to demand little more than the last word....You seem to demand little more than the last word. Empress Trudyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06073538968722986065noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-89187392378369825042015-06-09T23:01:54.306-07:002015-06-09T23:01:54.306-07:00When you tell people dismissively that what they b...When you tell people dismissively that what they believe is in their imagination without basis in reality, what good reason to engage further?<br /><br />If only you did not defend Obama no matter what, it might not seem like you are a sycophant.<br />oldschooltwentysixhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15672887176887940797noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-45002476787246051292015-06-09T22:47:49.623-07:002015-06-09T22:47:49.623-07:00Jeff, of course you are right that BOTH parties ha...Jeff, of course you are right that BOTH parties have a history of voter suppression but only one party is actively engaged in it at the current time and that is what I am going with. It's not the Dems. currently trying to subvert the Voting Rights Act. <br /><br />I know you will read this unlike oldschool or Trudy, so not only do I appreciate that but I will tell you, I don't think President Obama or Current Democrats are the "be all, end all" of politics. Frankly, I put Pres. Obama 4th or 5th on my "favorites" list behind Roosevelt, Lincoln, Clinton, and maybe Jefferson (though I actually like Eisenhower). But while I think there are legitimate criticisms of him, I don't think the one raised here most of the time are, and certainly not the one raised in this cartoon. <br /><br />If one wants to get on him for his treatment of Israel - criticize his handling of the Gaza Conflict last summer. OR criticize him for caving on the Iran deal. You will hear no complaints from me as long as the critiques are reality based. Criticize him as you are doing here - and btw, I cannot argue with much of what you have written. <br /><br />BUT if one wants to trade in "well he called Abbas first" (which by the way may not even be true), or he insults Israel because he doesn't do what the Israeli Right thinks he should do.. I think that is worth calling out. In this case, that cartoon is dead wrong and it's provable. It's not just an interpretation. It is just factually wrong. <br /><br />The other thing that gets me Jeff, is that IF one is going to criticize him, back it up with something better. You don't like what he is doing fine. So criticize and propose a better action. That is something else Republicans sorely lack. For example, criticize the ACA all you want, but, do it with honest criticisms not some Palinesque death panel bullshit. Then propose what are you going to do to replace it and provide specifics OR simply say that you feel the system was working before that or that you simply feel people should die in the streets because they were either too poor or too irresponsible to provide healthcare. If one wants to take a Social Darwinist view then own it. You may come off like a prick but it is what you believe. And that's fine. (I don't mean you Jeff, I am using the you as interchangeable with "One").<br /><br />Anyway, that is my point here. Unlike the silly fantasies that Trudy or oldschool actually believe (because they just argue with the character of volleyboy in their head and don't actually read or understand what I write), the President is just a guy who I think is doing a damn good job in face of incredible Republican obstructionism and I blame them for 90% of the problems there. He is not perfect, and he is not Superman, but I am damn glad he is our President now, and while I hope Bernie Sanders is our next Pres. I will gladly vote for HRC because she is light years ahead of that insane Clown Posse that the Republicans are tossing up for office. volleyboy1https://www.blogger.com/profile/02899507817699308811noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-33442002435955278542015-06-09T21:58:10.218-07:002015-06-09T21:58:10.218-07:00LOL...
Good to see that you take it on yourself ...LOL... <br /><br /><em>Good to see that you take it on yourself to determine what has basis of reality.</em><br /><br />I am not blind to reality just because I don't like something. It's pretty easy to see, but, first you have to take the blinders of hate off. Then maybe you will give credit where credit is due. <br /><br /><em>That the doctor thing was not false. </em><br /><br />It is absolutely false. The rules of the ACA are clear, either doctors can work within those guidelines or they don't. Those guidelines are beneficial to the patients as both patients as well as consumers. No one was forced to switch doctors UNLESS insurance carriers did not want to conform to those rules. If those carriers did not want conform to the law then there was an issue. BUT NO ONE was told as long as their doctors and insurance carriers conformed to the Law that they had to switch. <br /><br /><em>Next you will tell us Benghazi was about a movie.</em><br /><br />It was not, but the movie did play a role. You know what played even more of a role.... The fact that the Republicans were responsible for budgetary cuts in Embassy Security that started in the Bush Administration and were simply continued. It's amazing to me that when your boy Bush was in office, you guys were silent about all the Americans killed in attacks on embassies around the world. I believe 69 Americans died in those attacks and that does not count Iraq. And now all of a sudden, four Americans die in a tragedy in Benghazi and it is the biggest scandal ever. I guess those other 69 people were just in embassies at the wrong time for you guys to care... eh?<br /><br /><em>I wonder if you have a picture of Obama as Superman on your desk</em><br /><br />No... I have him in Jesus' robes with a Golden Light behind him preaching to a flock of people and lambs. Let's get these things right shall we?volleyboy1https://www.blogger.com/profile/02899507817699308811noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-1565960987400550712015-06-09T21:45:51.332-07:002015-06-09T21:45:51.332-07:00"It's one of the reasons I really dislike..."It's one of the reasons I really dislike the Republican Party as they are actively engaged in voter suppression. "<br /><br />Whereas the Democrats only passively engage in voter suppression while pretending they want every citizen to vote? There is a long and ugly history to this sort of thing and neither party is innocent. <br /><br />volleyboy1, <br />I do not think Obama is against the existence of Israel. But with all due respect, I do think his judgment, policies, and orientation leave much to be desired in the area of diplomacy, I do believe he tried to pressure Israel in the past for continued support at the UN and has used it as a threat recently. I don't think that is right. I think much of his policy comes from a part of the left that simply has it wrong. <br />Support for Israel at the UN should really be a no-brainer. A moral, and cleared-eyed policy would be to simply call out in no uncertain terms what goes on at the UN vis a vis Israel for what it is, absolutely refuse to cooperate with it in any way, and get that nonsense off the table once and for all. Show some leadership, and give the EU a moral spanking for their own part of the "human rights" masquerade. It shouldn't be too hard to get them to back down since they have no spine in the first place, only some old tall tales about Jews.<br /><br /><br />JeffwithaJhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07073609950380822171noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-8381748745482045692015-06-09T20:55:47.568-07:002015-06-09T20:55:47.568-07:00Good to see that you take it on yourself to determ...Good to see that you take it on yourself to determine what has basis of reality. <br /><br />That the doctor thing was not false. <br /><br />Next you will tell us Benghazi was about a movie.<br /><br />I wonder if you have a picture of Obama as Superman on your desk.oldschooltwentysixhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/15672887176887940797noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-24992167167527618842015-06-09T16:35:32.159-07:002015-06-09T16:35:32.159-07:00Err no they didn't. They said that allegations...Err no they didn't. They said that allegations of Israeli / U.S. Military and Intelligence cooperation not happening were "Completely False" (direct quote there). <br /><br />Trudy, you have to read beyond the headlines. Now I know that is tough to do but... what you are referring to, is that the U.S. has claimed that they have reduced the level of intelligence sharing with Israel on ONE ISSUE and one issue only. They are reducing some of the info. on the Iranian Arms talks because the Israelis were going out and spilling secrets to Congressional Republicans (only) and the Press. PM Netanyahu denied that claim but the NSA has them dead to rights on it. <br /><br />Anyway, That is hardly the same thing as saying they cut off cooperation a year ago. I thought you were a "realist". Or are you only a Headline Realist?<br />volleyboy1https://www.blogger.com/profile/02899507817699308811noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-42193574345881311692015-06-09T16:30:00.542-07:002015-06-09T16:30:00.542-07:00We still vote. I guess that really irritates the h...<em>We still vote. I guess that really irritates the hell out you. Sorry. </em><br /><br />Ummm what? You vote? Fantastic. Everyone should vote. I am a big fan of voting. It's one of the reasons I really dislike the Republican Party as they are actively engaged in voter suppression. <br /><br />I think voting is great.. why would it irritate me? I usually work for GOTV (Get Out The Vote) efforts. <br /><br />No need to apologize Trudy. It's just a simple mistake you made. I won't hold it against you. <br />volleyboy1https://www.blogger.com/profile/02899507817699308811noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-50511708302732623322015-06-09T16:26:50.213-07:002015-06-09T16:26:50.213-07:00LOL what should I read if I really want to be info...LOL what should I read if I really want to be informed? The Blaze? Breitbart? Maybe Patriot Daily? <br /><br />volleyboy1https://www.blogger.com/profile/02899507817699308811noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-12563099466281240442015-06-09T16:25:28.128-07:002015-06-09T16:25:28.128-07:00You do realize I am being sarcastic... Right? You do realize I am being sarcastic... Right? volleyboy1https://www.blogger.com/profile/02899507817699308811noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-51296310399770366532015-06-09T16:14:42.690-07:002015-06-09T16:14:42.690-07:00Yeah ok... I disagree with that. I think Israel an...Yeah ok... I disagree with that. I think Israel and the U.S. should be in full strategic alliance. Not only that but I think our commitment of aid should be more than it is now. I would like it if we were friends with Israel like we were with Canada or the U.K. volleyboy1https://www.blogger.com/profile/02899507817699308811noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-84004097064914870832015-06-09T16:12:50.877-07:002015-06-09T16:12:50.877-07:00I guess what irritates you the most is that your o...<em> I guess what irritates you the most is that your own view of Obama is a minority inside a minority in the very country you're shouting at me about to extol his greatness.</em><br /><br />I am not irritated Trudy... truly I am not. It's just internet blather. <br /><br />I am not "shouting" at you either Trudy. I am mocking you. Big Difference. <br /><br />To be totally honest with you... I don't really care what the Israelis think about President Obama. He is not President of Israel. He is President of the U.S. AND honestly I don't think he is the best thing under the sun... that is you who keeps saying I think that. <br /><br />Given the metric of President Obama vs. what could be. I think he is the best option out there (except for Bernie Sanders, Al Franken, Elizabeth Warren or Russ Feingold). But that is against a weak field. <br /><br />As for this nonsense: <br /><br /><em>If he was really, as you say, the every loving Messiah of the Jews...</em><br /><br />I said he was the Messiah of the Jews???? Huh???? Are you high? When did I ever say that. <br /><br /><em>then why is it that 91 out every one hundred people there think you're either insane or lying? Go ask THEM. Not me. THEM. </em> <br /><br />You know Trudy.. I actually know and hang out with Israelis. I lived there for a year. I met a few who thought I was insane (very few) and no one who thought I was a liar. Now, I get that you are ignorant on this subject, and that's ok. I get that you actually know very little about Israel. That's ok as well. But really.. what's with the delusions about what I believe? Are you proud of this? <br />volleyboy1https://www.blogger.com/profile/02899507817699308811noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-63851503882825636832015-06-09T16:04:50.975-07:002015-06-09T16:04:50.975-07:00to each their own I guess. enjoyto each their own I guess. enjoyEmpress Trudyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06073538968722986065noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-47925293592342128932015-06-09T16:04:03.165-07:002015-06-09T16:04:03.165-07:00You should stick to Salon or Buzzfeed. Sorry. You should stick to Salon or Buzzfeed. Sorry. Empress Trudyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06073538968722986065noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-49281642736675416292015-06-09T16:03:20.663-07:002015-06-09T16:03:20.663-07:00We still vote. I guess that really irritates the h...We still vote. I guess that really irritates the hell out you. Sorry. Empress Trudyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06073538968722986065noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-91617121511045369492015-06-09T16:02:48.487-07:002015-06-09T16:02:48.487-07:00The White House and the Pentagon said it. The White House and the Pentagon said it. Empress Trudyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06073538968722986065noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-59321545442360985282015-06-09T16:01:29.193-07:002015-06-09T16:01:29.193-07:00That's something I've pushed for. Israel s...That's something I've pushed for. Israel should downgrade relations with the US - perhaps to a trade mission. Empress Trudyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06073538968722986065noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-28868210500620066042015-06-09T16:00:20.784-07:002015-06-09T16:00:20.784-07:00He seems to think he is. After all, you're the...He seems to think he is. After all, you're the one screaming he more or less should be. I guess what irritates you the most is that your own view of Obama is a minority inside a minority in the very country you're shouting at me about to extol his greatness. If he was really, as you say, the every loving Messiah of the Jews, which is what you're alluding to, then why is it that 91 out every one hundred people there think you're either insane or lying? Go ask THEM. Not me. THEM. Empress Trudyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06073538968722986065noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-6579213173749170024.post-54707246658514209432015-06-09T13:15:01.951-07:002015-06-09T13:15:01.951-07:00Yep... Forever and ever. And after we fix the rule...Yep... Forever and ever. And after we fix the rules so that in 2016 he can be Dictator for Life we should be all good!..<br /><br />All Hail Obama... Oh and he is not just the Sun God Trudy.. He is everything in the world to me. Now let me get back to my line of Barack Obama action figures.... ;-)<br />volleyboy1https://www.blogger.com/profile/02899507817699308811noreply@blogger.com