Thursday, September 13, 2012

Democrat Legislator warns American Jews -- "Don't vote for Obama!"


geoffff



hat tip Daphne Anson

cross posted   Geoffff's Joint 


41 comments:

  1. Heya Geoffff, thanks for this.

    My prediction is that Jewish support for Obama will drop from about 80 percent in 2008 to under 65 percent come November 2012.

    Let's hope!

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    Replies
    1. I hope so as well. But then there's this:

      "Obama lead over Romney grows among Jewish voters

      "Gallup poll data published by Buzzfeed.com indicates 70 percent of registered Jewish voters plan to vote for Obama up from 64 percent this spring.
      By Haaretz | Sep.15, 2012 | 1:57 AM | 11

      "President Barack Obama's lead over Republican challenger Mitt Romney among Jewish voters is growing, according to recent unreleased Gallup daily tracking poll data reported on Buzzfeed.com.

      "According to the polling data taken between July 1 and September 10, 70 percent of registered Jewish voters plan to vote for President Obama. Only 25 percent of voters stated they were planning to vote for Mitt Romney, with 5 percent undecided. These results indicate a decline from earlier this spring, when 64 percent of registered Jewish voters said they would vote for Obama and 29 percent said they would support his Republican contender.

      "The data Buzzfeed.com obtained from Democratic sources has a margin of error of 4 percent. If the poll data faithfully predicts the real voting data, the Jewish support for Obama would be more or less equivalent to the support the Jewish community gave in 2008, when 69 percent of Jewish voters cast their votes for Obama and a mere 25 percent voted for John McCain.
      "
      The rise in Jewish support for Obama, seems to indicate that American Jews are less concerned with Israel than might be thought. Accusations Romney has been making, such as accusing Obama of "throwing allies like Israel under the bus," and with failure in dealing with Iran's nuclear program, don't seem to be helping garner Jewish support for the Republican candidate."

      I really hope this is just MSM agitcrock and not a realistic view.

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    2. I've come to appreciate that for very many people, including of course very many Jewish people, what's considered true is almost entirely dependent upon political inclinations and predispositions.

      The Obama administration believes it has the right to tell Jews where we may be allowed to live in the ancient Jewish city of Jerusalem and, yet, American Jews either refuse to see it or simply don't care.

      The Obama administration wrecked the peace process and blamed Israel for its own failure.

      Obama, himself, intimated that the Jews of the Middle East do not really want peace and condescendingly said that they need to search their souls, or words to that effect.

      The Obama administration is allowing Iran to acquire nuclear weaponry and refuses to acknowledge the rise of radical Islam, despite all the rioting and mayhem and murder presently taking place throughout the Middle East.

      The Democratic party, furthermore, changed its platform in ways detrimental to Israel.

      And still they will vote for Barack Obama in November.

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    3. Ignoring your patently false framing of the Obama administration policy towards Iranian nukes, can you can discern some difference between the policy of Obama towards Iran and that of Romney?

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    4. His framing isn't exactly false, it's just too lenient. Obama clearly is out to do whatever it takes to make sure Iran gets its nukes. If he gets a second term we'll find that out the hard way.

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    5. btw, let me ask you a question.

      If Israel were to take matters into its own hands a blow the holy crap out of Iran's nuclear production facilities, would you stand by Israel or no?

      In truth, I do not even recall you ever coming out in opposition to Iranian nukes.

      Are you?

      .
      .
      .

      As for Romney, that is a deflection.

      We cannot know what Romney will actually do when in office, but we know what Obama has done.

      Nothing.

      Nothing that will actually prevent the mullahs from pointing nuclear weaponry at half the world's Jews.

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    6. Stuart, is my framing false?

      The Obama administration is allowing Iran to acquire nuclear weaponry...

      The IAEA has reported that Iran's advance toward nukes continues.

      So how is this false "framing" when it is simply a fact?

      The Obama administration is not only doing virtually nothing to prevent Iran from attaining nukes it is actively working to prevent Israel from doing so.

      Face facts.

      The truth is not something that is dependent upon your political preferences.

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    7. Yes, your framing is false. Obama has never been big on blustery words. That's the only discernable difference between he and Romney. Romney wants to yell louder. And I have come out strongly in opposition to Iranian nukes right here on this blog. Though I don't think my feeling on the matter is all that important. Neither the Israeli government, nor the US government, nor almost every other government in the world wants Iran to have nukes. And there are at least 2 that are willing to do anything to prevent it from happening.

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    8. No red line, Stuart, as suggested by Dershowitz to erase uncertainty? It is our position, after all, to prevent rather than contain.

      http://www.gatestoneinstitute.org/3314/obama-iran

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    9. Really? Stupid words like "red line" are significant?

      Ack! No red line!! OMFG! He must want the Jews dead!

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    10. Just wanted to see where you stood. The words may be more significant than you acknowledge.

      Yes, Stuart, Dershowitz must want the Jews dead!

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    11. Not Dershowitz. Obama. And Dershowitz says exactly the same thing Romney says. Yell louder. Do you know that Obama isn't yelling louder where you can't hear him? Did he yell about getting OBL before OBL was dead?

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    12. Sometimes it means more to yell louder. It clarifies for all.

      I suggest you cannot hear Obama either, which means you have no better idea if he is yelling louder or cowering in a corner, despite what you imply. Just as you have no idea what Romney would do compared to what Obama has done.

      So what do you propose? Containment?

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    13. I don't think there is an easy answer. I have no doubt that Iran wants nuclear weapons. I'm quite sure that both the US and Israel (among others) are doing everything within their powers to stop that from happening. Yelling louder may have political ramifications in both the US and Israel. It's effectiveness as a deterrent to Iran is doubtful.

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    14. Stuart wrote:

      "Ignoring your patently false framing of the Obama administration policy towards Iranian nukes..."

      There is something wrong with very many Jewish people...as there has been for over two thousand years.

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asperger_syndrome

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stockholm_syndrome

      The Paradox of the Jewish Mind, by David Solway
      http://pajamasmedia.com/blog/the-paradox-of-the-jewish-mind/?singlepage=true

      The Psychology of Populations under Chronic Siege, by Kenneth Levin
      http://www.jcpa.org/phas/phas-046-levin.htm

      Explaining Jewish Political Behavior, by Barry Rubin
      http://rubinreports.blogspot.com/2010/08/explaining-jewish-political-behavior.html

      ----

      Randall wrote:

      "His framing isn't exactly false, it's just too lenient."

      Exactly.

      ----

      Barack Obama:

      O As one of his first actions as President of the United States of America, issued a speech, in Cairo, Egypt, in which he told lies about Islam which obfuscated facts about Islam and which glorified Islam, and told lies which ("sophisticatedly" (but, to the non-stupid, obviously)) libeled and vilified Israel, and which was a speech to which he, against the will of the then-President of Egypt, invited the Muslim Brotherhood -- who attended his speech and who, upon the invitation by Barack Obama for them to do so, sat in the first row of the audience to that speech by him
      O Refused to support the Iranian anti-Islamic-regime demonstrators in Iran in 2009 after the 2009 fraudulent elections in Iran
      O He and Hillary Clinton and his administration publicly officially explicitly endorsed the Muslim Brotherhood's entry into the government of Egypt
      O Has been supporting the OIC's (Organization of Islamic Cooperation's) United Nations campaign to outlaw any speech -- including truthful speech -- which the OIC, in accordance with the tenets of Islam, deems to be "criticism of Islam"
      O Has been supporting an effort to make "laws" passed by the (OIC-dominated) United Nations be enforced in, and supersede and override the national laws of, all nations in the world, including the United States of America
      O Has had, as friends and political advisors, pro-Fatah-PLO "overt" anti-Jewish racists (Rashid Khalidi etc.) and Western anti-Israeli bigots (less "overt" anti-Jewish racists) (Samantha Power (who, btw, has said that the U.S. should militarily attack Israel), Zbigniew Brzezinski (who, btw, supported the establishing of Ayatollah Khomeini as the leader of Iran), etc.)
      O Has blamed the continuously intendedly genocidally besieged, repeatedly militarily attacked, repeatedly terroristically attacked, universally libeled, now universally deceitfully diplomatically besieged, newly-re-founded, liberal democratic, culturally diverse, vibrant (and, BTW, technologically, medically, scholastically, globally exceedingly beneficent and beneficial), peace-longing, insanely detrimentally generous land-conceding, very small sole nation of the Jewish people -- Israel -- for the lack of a peace agreement between Fatah-PLO-PalestinianAuthority -- an actual Nazi-originated ideologically genocidal racist anti-Jewish organization -- and Israel, and for the lack of the existence of a "Palestinian" Arab state in what is now called "The West Bank" (Judea (Yehouda) and Sameria (Shomron)) and in what is now called "The Gaza Strip" -- which, in fact, would be a second "Palestinian" Arab state -- in addition to the "Palestinian" Arab state Jordan
      O He, in defiance of national agreements, and in defiance of basic diplomatic protocol, and in defiance of basic decency, while the Prime Minister of Israel was en route to visiting him, issued a demand to the government of Israel ("Return to '1967 borders'") which, if conceded to by the government of Israel, would immanently endanger the existence of Israel (and, therein, the lives of the Jewish people in Israel)

      (continued)

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    15. (from continued)

      O He, when the Prime Minister of Israel was visiting him in the White House, left to eat dinner with his family
      O He, while at a news conference with the President of France, when he and the President of France wrongly thought that the microphone was not on, and when, at that time, the President of France said, about the Prime Minister of Israel, "'Netanyahu, I can't stand him. He's a liar.", said: "You're sick of him, but I have to deal with him every day." (These are not children in a playground. These are leaders of the governments of countries. These are people whose beliefs and resultant actions are the policies of the governments of their countries.)
      O For twenty years, was a member of a Black Liberation Theology nominally Christian church whose pastor issued racist anti-Jewish anti-Israeli sermons and whom Barack Obama subsequently referred to as being his mentor
      O As a young man, associated with, and was a member of, Marxist subversive political organizations
      O Associated with, and was groomed to become a political leader in the United States of America by, American Communist Radicals -- wealthy American Communist Radicals
      O During his formative adolescent years, had, as a mentor and father figure of his, a Communist pro-Soviet, ideological hater of the United States of America, Frank Marshal Davis, who was introduced to him by his grandfather -- his mother's father
      O Appointed self-professed Marxists to high positions in his Presidential administration
      O Had, for several years as a child, an Islamic upbringing
      O Is the son of an ideologically pro-Soviet anti-Western so-called "Anti-Colonialist" father and a Communist American mother

      These facts are just the tip of the iceberg.

      Tarek Fatah, a Pakistani Canadian, liberal democrat, truly "moderate" Muslim (non-Sharia-proponent Muslim (non-orthodox Muslim)), describes some more of the tip of the iceberg:

      Obama's ties to the Muslim Brotherhood
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BmM6uQknAtc

      ----

      AMERICA IN CRISIS SECURITY BRIEF: Muslim Brotherhood In The Government by John Guandolo (1of13)
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r2ra7wD39dY

      The Organization of Islamic Cooperation and its Role in Enforcing Islamic Law
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ey-TRpkUiPI

      ----

      Part of the reason that very many Jewish American people are still supporting Barack Obama is because the American news mass media is not reporting anything essential about what is happening in the world, and is outright lying about crucial current events in the world, and is engaging in a propaganda campaign which obfuscates facts about Barack Obama, and which glorifies Barack Obama.

      (An example of this is explicitly documented with raw video footage in the following video (in the first three minutes of the video): "MUST SEE Political Correctness Exposed! Marxism Communism Frankfurt School: End of Freedom" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UhugUzUuPkE )

      However, this, on its own, cannot, and does not, account for how so many, let alone any, Jewish people could, at this time, still be supporting Barack Obama.

      Again:

      There is something wrong with very many Jewish people...as there has been for over two thousand years.

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Asperger_syndrome

      http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stockholm_syndrome

      The Paradox of the Jewish Mind, by David Solway
      http://pajamasmedia.com/blog/the-paradox-of-the-jewish-mind/?singlepage=true

      The Psychology of Populations under Chronic Siege, by Kenneth Levin
      http://www.jcpa.org/phas/phas-046-levin.htm

      Explaining Jewish Political Behavior, by Barry Rubin
      http://rubinreports.blogspot.com/2010/08/explaining-jewish-political-behavior.html

      ----

      Essential resource for essential information about the current situation in the world:

      Center for Security Policy
      http://www.youtube.com/user/securefreedom

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    16. Amil Imani on, among other things, the Islamic regime in Iran:

      Ex-Muslim, whistleblower Imani cautions 'infidels': "Stop sharia before it stops you"
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TXzDAhQPcX0

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    17. Thank you for all the hard work Daniel. It wasn't the least bit responsive to anything I said.

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    18. How do you know that it is doubtful as to effectiveness? It might be a powerful deterrent that would give Iran pause. If we are serious about prevention, it could deter Israel from acting precipitously. How are you so sure that the US and others are doing everything within their powers, when you acknowledge that we cannot know what, if anything, goes on behind closed doors?

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    19. Stuart,

      What I posted is a response to the essence of what you expressed.

      I hope that, if you have not read what I wrote, you will read what I wrote.

      And I hope that you will watch, and listen to, the videos that I linked to.

      Delete
    20. Stuart,

      I think that what I wrote in, and how I wrote, my initial comments that I wrote in response to your comments may have been harsh, and may have been hurtful to you, and, therein, may have been wrong. I apologize.

      ----

      And I apologize to all of my fellow Jewish people if what I wrote was harsh and if what I wrote was, therein, hurtful, and, therein, wrong of me to write.

      However, the facts that I wrote are important, and the videos that I linked to are important, and I hope that Jewish people will read what I wrote and will watch and listen to the videos that I linked to.

      Kind regards to all of my fellow Jewish people.

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    21. BTW:

      A Jewish Holocaust survivor tells the truth...about Western leaders...particularly ABOUT GEORGE W. BUSH:

      Vilifying Jews Revived as Demogogue Ploy by Powers - Holocaust Suvivor
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6dWwHIiqsPM

      ----

      Again:

      Is the US an ally of Israel? - A chronological look at the evidence, by Francisco Gil-White
      http://www.hirhome.com/israel/hirally.htm

      Understanding the Palestinian Movement - Part 4., by Francisco Gil-White; "How did the 'Palestinian movement' emerge? The British sponsored it. Then the German Nazis, and the US."
      http://www.hirhome.com/israel/pal_mov4.htm

      Will there soon be an anti-Jewish genocide in Israel?, by Francisco Gil-White
      http://www.hirhome.com/israel/catastrophe_en.pps

      ----

      The remedy:

      Jewish people's standing up for themselves -- Jewish people's telling the truth; therein, Jewish people's protecting themselves, and, also, therein, Jewish people's protecting their fellow Jewish people, and, also, therein, the resultant protecting of all of the people in the world.

      ----

      "Democratic-reformer in exile, Morad Moallem, explains the mentality of the totalitarian power ruling Iran and seeking complete Middle East oil domination, and the defeat of Western resistance to Islamic domination."

      Apocalyptic Cult Ruling Iran Exploits Islamic Imperialism to Spread Power
      http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fOPpxzDb9wU

      ----

      What can Western powers do to stop the Islamic regime in Iran from attaining nuclear weapons?

      Enforce crippling sanctions on Iran which will shut down Iran's oil and gas trade; and verbally condemn the regime in Iran; and diplomatically isolate the regime in Iran. Thereby topple -- dissolve -- the Islamic regime in Iran.

      For Western powers to do that there needs to be political will by Western powers to do that.

      For there to be political will by Western powers to do that there needs to be Western public opinion that demands that Western powers do that.

      For there to be Western public opinion that demands that Western powers do that the Western public, and especially the American public -- the American people -- must know the essential facts of the situation.

      In order for the Western public, and especially by the American public -- the American people -- to know the essential facts of the situation, the essential facts of the situation need to be communicated to the Western public, and especially to the American public -- the American people.

      The essential facts of the situation that need to be communicate are the true factual history, and current reality, of the situation that Israel is in.

      What needs to be done?

      Jewish people's, and, most importantly, the leaders' of the government of Israel, communicating the true factual history, and current reality, of the situation that Israel is in to the American public -- the American people.

      Delete
    22. Stuart,

      I would remind you that 2 + 2 does, in fact, equal 4.

      I wrote the following, which you call "false framing":

      The Obama administration is allowing Iran to acquire nuclear weaponry...

      This claim can only be considered "false framing" if the Obama administration is preventing Iran from acquiring nuclear weaponry.

      Since the IAEA shows that this is not the case then it is, indeed, a fact that the Obama administration is allowing Iran to acquire nuclear weaponry.

      Here is the Ha'aretz article on the IAEA report from August 30, 2012.

      "IAEA report: Iran doubled its underground nuclear capacity"

      http://www.haaretz.com/news/middle-east/iaea-report-iran-doubled-its-underground-nuclear-capacity-1.461813

      2 + 2 = 4.

      It gets exceedingly tiresome having to perpetually argue that the obvious is the obvious and what I continue having a difficult time understanding is why acknowledging that which is obvious can be so difficult for so many political people.


      Delete
    23. Ok, in that vein, Morsi is a member of the Muslim Brotherhoood, he is also the president of Egypt. Therefore Netanyahu is allowing, even encouraging, the rise of the Muslim Brotherhood in Egypt, because he has not stopped it. That should be obvious to all. It shouldn't be difficult to grasp. Based on your logic, he is the worst thing that has ever happened to Israel. While we're at it, he also must be allowing Iran to acquire nuclear weaponry. I'm not sure why any Jew would support him.

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    24. You are deflecting.

      Let's stay on the subject, OK?

      Barack Obama told the world that he "has Israel's back" and will prevent Iran from gaining nuclear weaponry.

      My claim is the following:

      The Obama administration is allowing Iran to acquire nuclear weaponry...

      Since the IAEA reports that Iran has doubled its underground nuclear capacity we can rightly conclude (at least as of this moment) that, indeed, the Obama administration is allowing Iran to acquire nuclear weaponry.

      Period.

      Now that may change in the future, although I find that exceedingly doubtful.

      btw, if Israel were to bomb the holy crap out of Iranian nuclear weaponry development sites it will be savaged by the international left.

      If that happens will you support Israel's actions or oppose them?

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    25. I'm not deflecting at all. I'm explaining to you why I think your framing is simply false. I'm sure you reject the way I framed Netanyahu's actions, no? I framed it exactly the way you framed Obama's actions.

      Israel will do what it needs to do. If bombing the crap out of Iranian facilities is what they end up doing, I trust that it will be the right thing to do. I trust that neither one of us wants that to be the only option available. But if it is, then it is.

      Delete
    26. 'Thank you for all the hard work Daniel. It wasn't the least bit responsive to anything I said.'

      Ain't no cure for willful blindness.

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    27. Right. If someone doesn't see things the same as you, they must be autistic. Or suffering from Stockholme Syndrome. Or just can't see the truth. THE TRUTH. Because there is THE TRUTH and what everyone else believes. Liberalism is a mental illness. There's a liberal hiding under your bed.

      Do you even realize how incredibly offensive that shit is?

      Randall, I don't know you from adam's cat. Nor do you know me. But I will tell you a little about me. I'm not a believer. In anything.

      Delete
  2. Stuart,

    you're dancing and deflecting.

    Look, it's very simple.

    Barack Obama claimed that he was going to prevent Iran from gaining nuclear weaponry.

    My claim is that he is not doing so and the evidence is the fact that Iran is advancing on their nuclear ambitions according to the IAEA.

    You seem to want to suggest that even though Iran is advancing on their nuclear weapons program that this somehow means that Obama is preventing that advancement when he is not.

    You seem to want to suggest that 2 + 2 = 37.5.

    It doesn't.

    .
    .
    .

    btw, you claim not to believe in anything.

    You do realize the inherent contradiction in such a claim, don't you?

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    Replies
    1. Does Iran have nuclear weapons today? I don't think there's any evidence that they do. In which case the argument is just as good that Obama has succeeded.

      And no, I don't see any inherent contradiction.

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    2. Stuart,

      I do not believe you when you say that you believe in nothing.

      This may be because I just misunderstand you.

      Will you tell us what you mean by that?

      Delete
    3. I have no religious like beliefs. Not in god. Not in the tooth fairy. Not in the good or bad of Obama, nor the good or bad of Islam.

      And it was a bit of hyperbole. I do believe in science. And I do believe in logic.

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    4. Science and logic do not cancel morality.

      The practice of science and logic are contrary to Islam, as are Jews and a whole lot of other things.

      Does there come a point where one must make a value judgment?

      As I see it, it is impossible to remove value judgments despite what people claim.

      Delete
    5. Contrary to fundamental Christianity too. And I suspect maybe even some fundamental Judaism. Only peripherally related, I recently came across a quote from the Dalai Lama.

      “If science proves some belief of Buddhism wrong, then Buddhism will have to change."

      Delete
    6. Yet it is evident from the manner of your responses that you make moral judgments that favor science and logic. What happens in those myriad areas of humanity where science and logic have effect no value? Or do they simply not exist in this frame of reference?

      Delete
    7. Oh, pish-posh.

      I am not particularly religious, either, and I think that you know that.

      I suppose the main question that interests me is whether or not, after 2,000 years of getting our collective ass kicked and after 1,300 years of dhimmitude followed by a century of war against us, thus keeping our numbers diminished, "progressives," such as yourself, consider the Jews guilty of being mean to our oppressors.

      My suspicion is that nice, intelligent Jews like you actually think that we're the guilty party.

      5.5 million Jews surrounded by 400 million Arabs and you honestly believe we're guilty of being mean to them.

      Am I wrong?

      I bet I am not.

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    8. Michael, If you're asking me about persecution of Jews in general over the last 2,000 years, and whether the fault for that persecution lay with the Jews or the persecutors, I would say the persecutors.

      But the specific issues between the Palestinians and the Israelis over the last 100 years is not exactly the same thing. We have a history of centuries of inter-generational persecution of Jews in the region. We have the mindset of the Arabs, who see the Israelis as invaders of their lands, on top of that cultural history. Have Israelis ever been mean to the Palestinians? Of course. But relative contributions to the current lack of secure borders for both the Israelis and the Palestinians is not equal. There could be peace if each side wanted it. There are things the Israelis could have done better, could have and should have done differently. But clearly the Palestinians and their Arab neighbors have, over the last 70 years, wanted it less.

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    9. Ya know, I am not so sure of this:

      But the specific issues between the Palestinians and the Israelis over the last 100 years is not exactly the same thing.

      The Arab war against the Jews began with the fall of the Ottoman empire and, thus, the freedom of the Jews from dhimmitude.

      In that sense it is a continuation of the traditional, theologically-based, Muslim persecution of the dhimmi Jews in the Middle East.

      The only reason that there is no peace between Jews and Arab-Muslims is because the Arab-Muslims are taught to believe that the Jews are inferior (the children of apes and pigs) and that the presence of a Jewish state on land that was once part of the umma is a transgression against Allah.

      What we've been seeing since the anti-Jewish pogroms of the 1920s is a continuation of anti-Jewish racist policies that goes back to the time of Muhammed.

      When we stand up for Israel, therefore, we are standing up for our civil liberties.

      Where do we disagree?

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  3. Replies
    1. Randall,

      I was going to comment at PSU, but I no longer have a login and when I try to re-register the confirmation code image breaks.

      FYI.

      {Not that I could discern it, anyway.}

      Delete
    2. Now that's strange. Look who managed to join just the other day.

      I'm going to send your comment to our other mods to see if they can assist.

      Delete